Glade I read this thread as I have some new molds to look after and will trySodium Hydroxide as well.
I take it is the same stuff you would clean the heads of a coffee machine with and sock your plates to make them look white again.
I would wear gloves when using sodium hydroxide and rinse very well.
Antonino;
Glad I could be of help!
Cheers
Brad
Hi William,
i think that all of us have have started or still use dish washing and hot water. The point was to find something that clean/degrease and no need to polish product.
If you have to deal with ca 200+ molds to clean, the scrubbing and the polishing (cotton wool i hate you!) is not real fun.
I have tried the Sodium Hydroxide and you should have seen the excitement on my employee's face seeing that with almost no work the mold where clean! After a quick rinse (i think we put too much SO in it.) the drying happened overnight and finished off with with a air-gun ( air compressor).
No Bloom, no marks on the chocolate. Now when i ask to have the molds clean, no ones run away!
Hi All,
we finally got our supply of Sodium Hydoxide, 25 l drum with a dil. of 40%
We tried a cup in about 40 lit of warm water and i must say it went so quick! my employees loved it! in few minutes we washed everything.
The rinsing part was a bit of issue: the molds after 2 rinse still have a slippery feel, not the "squicky" one as i was expecting.
@Brad and any one else: do i need to rinse them more or reduce the amount of Sodium or is just normal?
thanks in advance!
I picked up some deep fryer cleaner (sodium hydroxide-based) today from smart and final and used it at 1 cup per 1 gallon water and it worked great. it doesn't list concentration of NaOH. its not the cheapest stuff at $10/gallon but its worth the $1 in cleaning materials to not have to cotton ball all of my molds.
Brad, you are referring to Red Lightening that Clay mentioned in your most recent post of approx. 14 hours ago?
brad...that's what i thought and was suspicious for 
Yes, that does make more sense --- now to figure out what to do with half a gallon of janitorial strength ammonium hydroxide Glad this got sorted out before i started looking for the stronger stuff (I used to work with concentrated NH4OH at my old job and it fumes when you open the bottle...nasty stuff to use even with a fume hood.)
Don't use it straight. It can be considerably diluted in warmwater, removes ALL cocoa butter very nicely with almost no effort. The molds will feel slippery when being rinsed, and you'll see the water sheet right off of them. No spots. We take a bit extra care and use a hair dryer to blow off the remaining few spots.
Ahhh, Brad - that makes so much more sense . I am glad this got straightened out - ammonium hydroxide is pretty nasty stuff. Not that sodium hydroxide (aka lye, caustic soda) is a cakewalk.
Please note, everyone, that this provides a very good reason to RTFM (that is, read the material safety data sheet, or MSDS) on any chemical you are considering using. I was looking at the MSDS for ammonium hydroxide and wondered what others knew about it that I couldn't find out.
In doing some follow up research on sodium hydroxide I ran across the following ( Red Lightning degreaser ), which might be a good (and perhaps safer and easier to handle) alternative for anyone who's at all skittish about using lye as a degreaser. I plan to try it - and I will let people know what I find out.
CORRECTION:
A while ago I put a post in here that we use Ammonium Hydroxide to clean our molds. THIS IS WRONG!!! What I meant to write is that we use a solution of water anddegreaser containing SODIUM HYDROXIDE.
IT WORKS AWESOME, AND REQUIRES NO DRYING OF THE MOLDS, WHICH COULD POTENTIALLY OVER TIME CAUSE SCRATCHES IN THE POLYCARBONATE.
Sincerest apologies everyone.
Brad
Someone came to me asking about sourcing ammonium hydroxide. I can find semiconductor grade, 99.5% pure 29% dilution - but the MSDS is pretty frightening for a product at that concentration.
What are people sourcing for the original strength before diluting to what level?
What exactly are the "make-up remover pads from walmart (less than $2 a pkg). They are soft cotton but don't leave the little fuzzies the balls do." Do you have a pic?
CAN YOU SHARE PICS PLEASE? I MAY BE HAVING SIMILIAR ISSUES........
Well, the ammonium hydroxide i found locally apparently wasn't strong enough. Its 10% according to the label, and I started with very weak solution and increased the concentration until I literally couldn't stand to breath the fumes (even tried a few drops of full strength and that didn't do the trick). The result was that the chocolate/cocoa butter was dissolved, but instead of staying in solution it coated my molds completely when i took them out to rinse.
Brad/Ben---you're the only two that have confirmed using NH4OH, what concentration are you buying off the shelf?
Interesting and yes I agree that the washing is a real pain. I went to a class with the technical advisor and they gave out Callebaut promotional materials. Inside it listed common reasons for bloom. Mold cleanliness was listed as a problem. Go figure.
Hi Mike,
What is the company in Canada you found that it supplies ammonium hydroxide?
Thanks,
Omar
Our bars have a lot of fine detail, and are cleaned with water/Amonium Hydroxide on a regular basis. The same18 molds (3 bars per mold)have made over 60,000 bars in the last 3.5 years and stilllook like new. They are washed and then dried with a micro fibre cloth.
Thanks Brad. I think I found some locally, hope its strong enough!
Real Canadian Wholesalers (Similar to Real Canadian Superstore). Both Owned by Loblaw's. Hope that helps.
Thanks for the reply Brad. I have a background in chemistry, so I was picturing ammonium hydroxide (lab grade, caustic), but then realized I couldn't find it as a cleaner so I thought maybe it was a nomenclature thing since NH3 + H2O <-> NH4OH.
I did find a company in Canada that supplies it, but only in Canada (unless I buy a truckload!). I will keep looking, but anyone in the US that can offer tips on a source, please let me know (I know of most of the lab supply houses, but they are generally pretty expensive when you want very pure/food grade solutions).
-Mike
I have been told by a notable chocolatier not to wash them out but polish with a shammy cloth. If you cleam them too often, more than monthly you will break down the polycarbonate .
There's a difference between ammonia and ammonium hydroxide. I don't know that I would recommend ammonia. I buy our ammonium hydroxicefrom a local commercial food wholesale store.
In the past I've used full strength (from the bottle), and it did no harm to the molds.
Be sure to wear protective gloves though.
For those of you using ammonium hydroxide--are you buying it from a lab supply company or using ammonia from the hardware store? I tried some dilute ammonia and it didn't really cut the cocoa butter much, but i was worried about ruining my molds by using higher strength.
thanks
mike
Instead of cotton balls, try cotton dish towels. The very thin ones work well. We use the warming cabinet, then wipe away residue. Seem to work pretty well. We don't wash every time.
Ben
We also have release marks on our bars, and we leave overnight. The bars are released from the moulds but just seem to leave a mark, which intensifies after use - being in Scotland we dont ever have a cool issue! It may be the bars are cooling too fast if anything. The marks do rub off easily off, but annoying just the same. We use PETG moulds, and i know when we have tried polycarbonate, we dont have the same problem. Just the tooling costs for polycarbonate are a bit prohibitive - but thats where we are heading i think - to be rid of the release marks.
Kate
Thank you for your help. I'm going to try that.
I'm using some pretty simple vacuum formed molds, which are kind of notorious for release marks. I've been able to minimize them with better cooling, but only rarely completely eliminate them. If left, the marks can add to the next batch's marks. I generally wait several batches before cleaning, but I think a quick dunk in an ammonium hydroxide solution and rinse after each batch would get the marks off without much effort.
Yes, I understand that polycarbonate is mainly used, but there are other higher quality plastics that are being used internally by large confectionerycompanies that are not currently being offered.
Ben;
If you have release marks, you're not letting the chocolate cool long enough. Well tempered chocolate will release itself from the molds, and allow you to make bars several times through the molds before you have to wash them.
Now having said that, if you don't have much detail in your molds, you should very seldom ever have to wash them. Our molds have lots of little tiny crevices and details where chocolate gets caught and doesn't come out. After a while we have no choice but to wash them.
Brad
The plastic has already been invented and is currently used in the Chocolate Industry. It's called Polycarbonate. This is the defacto plastic used in commercial quality molds.
Cheers.
Brad
I'm actually going to school right now to learn how to make molds via CAD/CAM/CNC. My hope is to use a different type of plastic that is water resistant and can withstand high heat and chemical soaps.
That's my thinking on the matter.
I always have a release mark on my bars that leaves a little remnant on the molds. So, I always intend to do a quick wash after every use, but in practice it's when the molds really need it. It would be a lot easier and quicker if I did it every time, though.
thanks!
i guess if you wash your molds so efficiently you don't need to sit there and polish like a maniac.
Ben -
Are you washing after every use? Or only when you need to.?
:: Clay
I generally dump about 1/2 cup - 1 cup ammonium hydroxide in a full sink.
Don't know about the rotating brush, but in one of those threads Brad mentions using a brush to clean stubborn chocolate. I use a very soft cloth with very little pressure.
thanks for the info! i also hate washing the molds extremely after a batch of 50 molds that has gone bad (bad, really bad blooming) and is faster to wash then just polish.
we use at the moment just warm water and dishwashing liquid but i will try the ammonium hydroxide,
what percentage per liter of water shall i use?
now a question about polishing the molds: my second best hobby!
i was thinking to buy a rotative brush (like the one that clean shoes at hotels) and put the softest brush you can find, would that work??
anyone ever tried?
i remember as trainee that was my job before go home: hours spent with cotton ball doing each little corner, nowadays seems impossible to ask the apprentice to do it...
I'll have to find the product literature that they gave me. I know it was on there. They listed all the causes of bloom, and that was one of them.
